May 30, 2007As a long-time active member of this once great church, it causes me much angst to see what has happened to this religious entity. During the early 1990's, this church was a pillar in the greater White Plains, NY community. The membership was vibrant and healthy in numbers. The church was actively involved in the civic affairs and almost every important aspect of the communities' lives. In any given month or quarter, one could look forward to shaking the hands of new members and welcoming them into the church with much spirit and love. It was especially heart-warming to see all of the children standing in line and welcoming primarily adults, adolescents & teens into the membership. As these new members came on board, they were anxious to join the various clubs, organizations and committees and immediately go to work serving their GOD and the people. The Senior Usher Board, being one of the most visible organizations in the church since they were at the doors and working on the floor during each service or major activity that took place at the "friendly church on the hill" at 65 Lake Street, White Plains, NY, the board was always attracting new members and there never was a shortage of ushers. Sadly over the past five to six years, the board has grown old and tired. There has been virtually no new members during this period and the numbers has dwindled to the point that future of the board is in doubt. The same can be said of vital boards such as the Trustees and organizations such as the choirs. For example, in 1999 there were five (5) vibrant and gifted church choirs; today there are two and only one seasoned musician who has also grown tired and weary. At the height in 1999, there were also as many as four musicians including the youth or chidren's choir.Basically, the church has been the victim of extremely poor leadership from the pastor who exhibits a "bunker mentality" by surrounding himself with a small but vocal group who has more concern for protecting him and slamming those persons who intelligently speak out about the dismal state of the church than doing what is best and necessary to help the church survive and remain relevant. The other major problem is with the church's heirarchy (the Presiding Elder and the Presiding Prelate or Bishop). They close their eyes and ignore all of the signs that this is a "failed church". All of the signals are there when the Quarterly & Annual Conferences are held. The few members who have the courage to speak up, ask pertinent questions and or write letters regarding the condition of the church and where it has been headed over the last three or four years are ostricized, ignored or suspended from serving on vital boards where they have made extremely significant contributions. While all of this is going on, the core members sit in silenced; afraid to attest to to what they know to be true. All of this as the result of a deliberate and succesful attempt to cause them to be hesitant about speaking out for fear of being silenced. The members must muster up the courage of those that have gone onto glory who would never have allowed this to happen to the church they soo loved and served for most of their lives!One telling example of the heirarchial problem occurred recently when one member wrote an open letter to the membership detailing a barrage of wrongdoings plus simply un-christian like behavior by the leader (pastor) and informed them of the reason why Mt. Hope is no longer viable financially. When there is no finances; there is not spirit! The letter was sent to the Presiding Elder alongwith additional information for her to assess and take action. After taking more than three weeks, she came back with the unfortunate reply of "I'm sorry that you are having issues with The A.M.E. Zion Church and that if only the person would sit down and have a face-to-face discussion with the Pastor, i'm sure all of the person's issues could be resolved". Anyone who read or would read the letters would know that the issues are with the membership regarding the incompetence of the Pastor and not any issues with the denomination itself! If this is the best that this level of the denomination's leadership can come up with, then our particular church is surely doomed! Mt. Hope Church pays conference general claims and district quarterly claims in amounts that far exceed it ability to pay and still operate finacially in any adequate manner, yet this is the level of oversight and attention we receive. What gives here? At a minimum, the Presiding Elder and Presiding Bishop should have come to Mt. Hope Church by now and hold a meeting to find out about these extremely serious issues and advise what course of action will be taken. The New York Annual Conference will be held at the end of June, 2007 and surely these issues need to be addressed before then as all of the pastors in this conference will be given their pastorial charge at that time. Clearly the current pastor cannot be re-appointed to Mt. Hope Church for another year; the church will definitely "crash and burn" if this were to happen. Let us see some true leadership from the Presiding Elder and Presiding Bishop so that the church can at least start the recovery process. Under the best of circumstances the recovery process will be slow and painful but at least there would be hope.There will be postings of the letters to the church membership and the Presiding Elder later this week so that you can gain an understanding of what is going on with Mt. Hope Church. Hopefully members of other churches in the A.M.E. Zion denomination will study this situation and not ever let this happen to their particular church. When the leaders of the church is worried about politics and running for heirarchial positions, they allow awful situations to unfold on their watch while taking no action. GOD help us now!!!Submitted by,Glover Davis,Member of Mt. Hope Church since 1967
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by In the Name of Religion
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Well, this is a sad story. A church is only as powerful as its leader and if its leadership is the problem, where does that leave the church? It looks as if that answer is nowhere. A church can be established on a wealth of Faith, but cannot be maintained if that Faith is without works. If this church is not rescued and nurtured to withstand the legacy it once held, it will leave an entire community without a vision, a tower of hope and a message in these trying times.
I noticed this blog was submitted “in the name of Religion.” The religion of Christianity, as far as I have learned to practice, does not support acts to break each other down, but to build each other up and consequently build the kingdom of God up as well. This sounds more to me like the issues of an individual, and it is up to the community of faith to pray for those that seek to hinder rather than help. God created us as individuals with separate minds and ideas. Cloning is not how we’ve been created. Learn to agree to disagree, and leave the condemnation to GOD.
response to "a christian said".....
It is not so hard to figure out who posted that message; it obviously was from someone in the religious heirarchy who is part of the problem that is being written about here. The tone seems to be in the vein of the quotation from the elder's response to the writer (Glover Davis)as indicated in the text of Davis's original posting. No wonder Davis had to take this approach. "Learn to agree to disagree, and leave the condemnation to GOD" is clearly a cop-out as GOD surely will condemn but he urges man to also take action to fix situations such as these. The same old religious trickery in trying to let the religious leaders do whatever they feel like doing. There is no addressing of the problem that Davis is talking about. I see what he is up against.
The response of "a Christian" was not of that of the "religious hierarchy," but of an individual that supports PEACE. Quite honestly, I see no approach in the original posting of Davis, I do however, see a personal bitterness and vindictiveness that needs to be addressed. No recommendation of the solution has been made, merely what he/she feels is needed to "rid the situation of." If you can't be part of the solution, it's time to stop being the problem.
Okay "a christian said", if you are in support and favor of peace, and you you choose to comment, that would lead me to believe that you too are aware of the happenings at this church...so what have you done to be a part of the solution or do you belive there is no problem???
The church is supposed to build eachother up, but how can you you when your membership is full of tension and unanswered questions that NOBODY seems to want to answer? How can you build up the kingdom of GOD with this kind of division amongst YOUR church family? I see no evidence of peace in this.
If you cant get the attention of those in the church who are supposed to have answers to your own questions/issues or seek them out when they dont, and the overall leadership chooses NOT to get to the source of these issues and VERIFY the validity of what Mr. Davis is saying for themselves, then where do you turn? If they did that and could prove that what he saying is not true, than he wouldnt have a leg to stand on, but they havent, and they wont.
God will condemn those whom he sees fit but he places people in positions to do the work of the church and hold up the principles designed to prosper a church and the community that it should reach out to. The community of faith should pray for one another without cease, not just for those who they imply are the problem.
So if you choose to reply to me,can you tell me this:
If FAITH without WORKS is dead, what WORKS will you do to be a part of the SOLUTION??? Unless you indeed feel there is no problem, what is your "approach"???
I think that this "bitter and vindictive member" of over 40 years, whom has made many contributions to his church family, is simply asking for an answer to his concerns and those who dont have the courage or will to stand and ask themselves.
"a christian said.....
Is clearly someone who is part of the problem rather than someone who claims that they are only seeking peace; how disingenious of this person to hide behind these kinds of cliches. The response is pretty strong and the person would have had to be privy to the communications that I sent out to the members of Mt. Hope Church and The Presiding Elder. I indicated that those communications would be posted over the next several days so how could "a christian said" be so knowing and accuses me of not having a solution? I have been preaching a solution for over three years now and as a matter of fact tried to head-off the worst part of the problem by warning of what was going to happen in June of 2004! When the problem is known, it needs to be addressed and a solution put forward. Clearly the heirarchy who has the power to do this has been sitting on the sidelines wishing that the problem would simply go away. How foolish and hypocritical that path is while the church crumbles. GOD surely wants his church to survive and prosper; let's decide who is trying to make that happen and who is indeed the problem? I challenge you to face the truth and try being honest for a change!!!!
Mt. Hope Updates.....
Hopefully, when one reads the postings; both commentary and inserts of the letters, you get a sense of what has been happening with the church. But more importantly, the question must jump out at you - what is the Presiding Elder going to do about the situation? Surely she will address each serious issue and get to the bottom of things. Well once you review the text of her e-mail responses to me (which I will post by the end of the day tomorrow) you will be truly schocked at her response. It will make you wonder just what is the point of having a presiding elder and presiding bishop if the best they can offer is to pray that the issues get resolved. How about carrying out their responsibilities to the member churches for a change!!!!
It is clear to see the Mt Hope is under spiritual attack. Many are called, but very few are chosen.
“We can do all things trough Christ.”
This is the foundation that we stand on. Knowing that our heavenly Father sees all the attacks of the enemy. In the lasts day the word of God say beware of false prophets you shall know them by there works. This is why it is so important to guard your heart and mind, these are the first areas that satin will attack. They feed on the weak and try to discourage the strong. Knowing the word as these leaders should, I wonder how they can even sleep at night. God is not a God of confusion.
Beware of false prophets...Matthew 7:15-29
15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening (hungry) wolves.
16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
28And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
29For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes (secretary, scholar; in the Greek, grammateus, town clerk.
Salvation is not something that you can buy, but it does come with a price. I have attended services at Mt Hope, and the spirit as a whole is very poor. The main thing that is required of true believers is to worship the Lord Jesus Christ in honesty and truth. True worshipers of Jesus know that they have a direct line to Him. “Seek and ye shall find, knock and the door will be opened.” Prayer is power, but the word of God stands strong in the time of battle. When I have to deal with worldly Christians I turned to the word of God.
Christian Behavior...Romans 13
1Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
6For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
7Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
8Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
10Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
11And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
12The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.
13Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.
14But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.
Learning to use the power of God that lives in me has not been easy. I struggle every day with my shortcomings. One thing that keeps me is the fact that he sees our inward parts. He see our hearts and knows what we have need of. Hold strong my Christian brothers and sisters. You have been in the struggle for six (6) years. Seven (7) is the number of completion continue in prayer and know that the day is near that you will see the might hand of God move. Continue to pray for those that misuse you and there positions for they have there reward. A house that is divided will not stand; therefore, this is the time for all members to join in pray that God will have is way in Mt Hope.
Well said.
AND THE APPLE DOES NOT FALL FAR FROM THE TREE, JUST TAKE A LOOK AT HIS SON ODINGA AT PRICE MEMORIAL IN AC NJ.....A FAMILY OF SUCH GREAT PREACHERS...THAT CHURCH IS NO LONGER THRIVING AS WELL, AND MADDOX THE 2ND IS JUST AS ARROGANT!
A.M.E. that is the problem
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